Details Are Sketchy
A bimonthly true crime podcast, in which two friends share an unsolved disappearance or unsolved case, a crime they're most intrigued by, and talk all things true crime.
Details Are Sketchy
Curtain Call: The Murders of Sam Herr and Julie Kibuishi
In this episode, Rachel gives us the disappearance of Ingrid Lane and Kiki brings us the murders of Sam Herr and Julie Kibuishi.
Our next book is "Little, Crazy Children: A True Crime Tragedy of Lost Innocence" by James Renner, which we will discuss in episode 24.
Sources:
Sam Herr and Julie Kibuishi:
20/20 "Mystery in Apartment 410" (2016)
20/20 "The Final Act" (2019)
Ingrid Lane:
"Family Desperate for Answers in Search of Albuquerque Woman in Jemez Springs" by Faith Egbuonu from KOAT Action News (November 6, 2023)
"Search for Peace in the Jemez Wilderness" by Gabrielle Porter from the Santa Fe New Mexican (May 27, 2024)
If you have any information contact the Albuquerque Police Department at 505-242-2677
Socials:
Instagram: Details Are Sketchy - @details.are.sketchy
Facebook: Details Are Sketchy - @details.are.sketchy.2023
Instagram: Kiki - @kikileona84
Instagram: Rachel - @eeniemanimeenienailz
Email: details.are.sketchy.pod@gmail.com
I'm Kiki and I'm Rachel, and this is Details are Sketchy A true crime podcast, and this is episode 21. 21.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're over the hump. We're old enough to drink. We are old enough to drink.
Speaker 1:We should have gotten cocktails we should have. That's okay. We're celebrating with going to see Twisters Twisters or Twister? Is it Twister or Twisters, twisters?
Speaker 2:Twisters. Sure, twister is the first one. No, I have no idea. I believe, so I don't remember. I mean, you're the expert on this film.
Speaker 1:I'm not even an expert. I didn't even know they were remaking it until the other day Earlier today, you told me Twisters.
Speaker 2:So Earlier the other day, earlier today, you told me Twisters. So that's what I'm going with.
Speaker 1:Well, I said Twisters. I don't know if it actually is. I guess it doesn't matter. We're going to see that movie with Glenn Powell and Daisy Edgar Jones Is that her name? That movie, yeah.
Speaker 2:The sequel to the Bill Paxton Helen Hunt movie back in the 90s, which was one of my favorites and gave me one of my greatest nightmares, which is not tornadoes. Speaking of nightmares, I want to see that long legs movie oh, rachel, maybe, maybe we'll see that one day.
Speaker 1:Okay, so episode 21 she doesn't want to see it I don't even think I know what it's about episode 21 it's supposed to be like an homage, sorry, it's.
Speaker 2:It's like an homage to like classic, like serial killer movies oh nice, that might be interesting and stuff that might be interesting, and it stars nicholas cage.
Speaker 1:Oh god sure, why not? Oh God, sure, why not? Maybe we'll go see that.
Speaker 2:I mean, nicolas Cage is an interesting actor. He is, and his performances are always something to see.
Speaker 1:That is very diplomatic of you, Rachel.
Speaker 2:No, not in a bad way.
Speaker 1:No, I know.
Speaker 2:He always brings something refreshing to the screen Okay, okay, sure, sure. And he's very popular in the horror genre.
Speaker 1:Nowadays, I didn't know that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's done some really interesting movies like mandy and the color out of space. Um, yeah, he's got this one and there's one other one that I'm trying to think of that he's in, but I can't think of it right at on the top of my tongue. But uh, yeah, he's, he's. He's developed quite a little cult following in the horror movie genre.
Speaker 1:Nice, so Nice, okay. So episode 21,. As always, one of us will be doing a missing person. That'll be Rachel this week, and then the other person is going to do the case, and that will be me this week, and we are boring for the last two weeks, so we may not have much to talk about, but we might do a little bit of gossipy, whatever. At the end this will likely be a short one, so yay, after the last several that are an hour plus. So what's happening?
Speaker 2:Oh, you're doing your missing person, okay so I'm going to start off with an overview.
Speaker 1:I think I just saved this into my oh wait, before you start let me just say I apologize if you hear all kinds of bumps and whatever. We are drinking tea and the table is kind of bumpy and also used to our weird tea sounds right now.
Speaker 2:You should be, but also you should be my grandmother is um.
Speaker 1:She refuses to wear her hearing aids, so the tv is quite loud and even though I have the door open, I can still hear it. So if you can, I apologize, it's svu, in case you're wondering, nice yeah, um, yeah, okay, go ahead.
Speaker 2:Sorry, better be used to our antics shakes fist.
Speaker 2:Okay, so our missing person I'm doing, Ingrid Colleen Lane, her age 37, her height 5'5" and her weight 120 pounds. On Sunday October 15, on Fre oh no, that's not Friday Freakway 144, 11 miles north of Highway 126, in a black 2019 Subaru Impreza hatchback with a broken rear window. The vehicle was found abandoned at the same location on Thursday October 18th. So and that is it does not say, but I believe this was in last year that she went missing. Let me check.
Speaker 2:I don't know why it doesn't say on this missing person little paper. Usually it says that, yeah, October 15th 2023. Sorry about that. I just had to double check because this missing person paper only said the, the month and the date, and so if you have any information regarding the whereabouts of ing, contact the Albuquerque Police Department at 505-242-2677. And it doesn't give a description of her, but there's a picture and she appears to be white or white passing, and she appears to have brown hair and I can't make out the color for eyes, but they look like they could be. They look lightish, like maybe they're blue or green and maybe hazel.
Speaker 2:so I know that's not usually it has this kind of information on the paper, but for some reason it's not there.
Speaker 1:That's true. You would think that they would want to do that. Well, we'll put a picture on our Instagram. Yes, we will.
Speaker 2:We will do that when we release the episode. I have an article as well that I'll go over later, so maybe it'll have that information.
Speaker 1:Okay, so stay tuned. Okay, so my turn now. Yes, sorry, that's okay. So I am doing the murders of sam her and julie kibuishi. I don't know if it's her or hair. It was said two different ways in the 2020s.
Speaker 2:I saw in there two 2020s yeah, I hate when that happens and yeah like, like I don't know, yeah, which one is the right one?
Speaker 1:I just want to say because I told Rachel earlier but I know she might laugh at me, but this is a Matt Murphy case. But I'm not doing it because it was a Matt Murphy case I have been Mm-hmm. It's true. I've been interested in this case long before I knew that Matt Murphy was the prosecutor. I didn't know that until last year and I'd heard of this case back when it happened.
Speaker 2:No, I believe you, but I definitely think that Matt Murphy was a bonus.
Speaker 1:He is definitely a bonus Icing on the cake. Icing on the cake, for sure, I mean, he's good to look at, so why not? So there are lots of episodes on this case. There's a date line, there's a 48 hours. There is a couple of other ones from like ID that I can't place right now, and then there are two 2020s. One is called the Mystery in Apartment 410, and that came out right around the time of the trial, so back in like 2015, 2016. And then there's revamped one called Final Act, which is like the old one, but with bonus material. I guess is the best way to describe it, and they're both good. If I remember the Dateline correctly, I believe that was also really good. I mean, it's a Keith Morrison, so obviously it's going to be good. I do believe the podcast version of the Dateline episode is still available, but I couldn't find. What am I trying to say? The visual episode yes remember.
Speaker 2:No, sorry if I had to look on my face, because I just remembered the name of the fourth nicholas cage movie that I was trying to think of.
Speaker 1:It's that renfield movie oh yeah, okay, yeah, I heard of that one. All right, I probably should have done trigger warnings or content warnings, but I didn't. I apologize for that. But also I want to say that this is honestly one of the reasons why it stuck with me, despite the fact that it's not particularly violent or brutal, but it's still really one of the worst crimes I've heard of. Really, because of how Should I buckle it for sad? Probably Because of how diabolical the killer is, although I don't like to use that word because it connotes devilish and evil.
Speaker 1:And I hate giving that kind of power to murderers but I can't really think of another word to fit which really sucks. The English language has more words than any other language in the world and yet we're so limited in so many ways. Yep, it's very irritating. Okay, so it's may 2010 and we are in costa mesa, orange county, california. It's a city of a hundred thousand people and averages around two murders a year, so it's a pretty safe place in Orange County, right, yeah, southern California, which part of Orange County? It is Costa Mesa? Oh, okay, so Julie Kibuishi is the 23-year-old daughter of Japanese immigrants. She is a very talented dancer. In fact, she's talented enough to be accepted into the prestigious Orange County School of the Arts, and kindness is the word most often used to describe her. That's nice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, sam Herr is a 26-year-old former Marine, with quote, bradley Cooper looks. Sometimes I could see that. Most of the time I didn't really see that, but he certainly wasn't hard to look at. When I was 26, I think he and I are the same age I probably would have looked at him a few times. Okay, anyway, he served in Afghanistan at Camp Keating, which, in case you don't know, was on the front lines, and it was pretty much under constant fire and he which, in case you don't know, was on the front lines and it was pretty much under constant fire and he actually volunteered to do that, so he was, I would say, pretty brave.
Speaker 1:One of his the guys he served with said that they were often under fire and it would last anywhere from 30 minutes to hours and Sam's job was to run through enemy fire to keep the generators going. Then he came back and, like many former veterans of Afghanistan and Iraq, he showed and other wars. He showed signs of PTSD. That'll be important later. So Julie and Sam met at community college. Julie was studying fashion. I don't know what Sam was studying, but in the second 2020 episode, the reporter or one of the reporters said that he was studying so that he could re-enlist and rise through the ranks. So education allows you to level up higher. That made it sound like a video game, but you all know what I mean.
Speaker 2:It did sound like a video game.
Speaker 1:Okay. So anyway, they had to take an anthropology class and Julie became his tutor for that class and through that they became very good friends. People, including his own parents, wondered if there was anything romantic in their relationship and he said absolutely not. She's like a kid sister to him. So according to most everybody it was really just a very close platonic friendship. She would hang out with him at his place, which was described as an apartment complex that would be reminiscent of Melrose Place, but bigger.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:In case you're too young to remember Melrose Place, you should check that out. It was good but not good I know about it, but I, you didn't, you didn't watch it. I only watched it a little bit when it first came out because I was definitely too young to watch it. But it is, um, it's about a lot of young people and their various escapades, what I remember, generally of a romantic nature. There was a lot.
Speaker 1:They did what young people, what beautiful young people do, diplomatic right, they're escapades of a romantic nature uh, all I remember, I think, is that, like heather locklear was in it at some point, am I thinking of the right one? I may not I thinking of the right one, I may not be thinking of the right one. There were a few shows around that same time that I remember watching episodes of, and they've all kind of meshed together in my brain, but it's a drama and you know, and kind of a soap opera, but not daytime soap opera, if you know what I mean Okay.
Speaker 1:So anyway, it's full of young people, so there's a lot of partying, a lot of hooking up and if we fast forward a bit, it's a Saturday morning in May. Julie's mom notices that Julie hadn't come home, so she texts her and calls her and there's no response. That same day Sam is supposed to be at his parents' house for the weekend, but he never showed up. So his dad, Steve, tried to call him, but Sam's phone was off. And Steve thinks that's odd because Sam never turned his phone off. He gives or, I'm sorry. He goes to Sam's apartment to make sure everything's okay when he walks in, everything's neat and clean. He tries calling Sam again, but his phone is still off. Steve walks into the bedroom and he sees a large amount of blood and a body. Her pants have been pulled down and Steve calls 911.
Speaker 1:So obviously the police seem to think it's a slam dunk case, right? Everything points to Sam being Julie's killer. In case you didn't guess, the body was Julie. The police put out an APB for him. They label him armed and dangerous. I mean, he is a trained veteran, Right, who suffers at least from mild PTSD. Yeah, Okay. So back to the scene, the apartment, yeah sorry, sorry to interrupt you, but aren't veterans?
Speaker 2:yeah, I usually consider like a higher level of danger automatically because, yeah, they're training yeah.
Speaker 1:So back to the scene. The apartment shows no signs of a struggle. Again, it's neat. Everything's in its place. I mean, there might be a few beer cans, like out on the patio or whatever, but you know it's not. There's no signs that anything happened. On the counter they find a wedding invitation for Sam's downstairs neighbors, daniel Wozniak and Rachel Buffett. They are both actors in the local community theater and that'll be important later, so stick a pin in that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, julie's body is on the bed. She had a gunshot wound to the head and is wearing a tiara, so the tiara had been given to her either by her brother or his fiancé to her, either by her brother or his fiance, the 2020s. One said one and one said the other and they, I guess, had asked Julie to be part of the wedding I think a bridesmaid, and according to Julie's mom, she was so excited about it and hadn't taken off the tiara. There is a message written on her shirt that says all yours, fuck you.
Speaker 1:The police hear a taylor swift song starting to play and they follow it and find julie's phone and they see that it had several texts from sam. He said that he was helping daniel with something and then was heading to his parents house, but then a few hours the tone of the messages change and he seems to be in distress, asking her to come over alone. The working theory is that Sam may have been drinking and or doing drugs and then snapped sexually assaulting her, killing her, and then he fled. Yeah, they ask Daniel and Rachel if they know anything. Daniel says that they hung out for a bit, but that sam left with some unknown guy in a black hat. Rachel also says that he left with a guy in a black hat. Stick a pin pin in that it's going to come back.
Speaker 2:The guy in the black hat.
Speaker 1:Yes, police and senior deputy district attorney Matt Murphy also think it's pretty obvious that Sam killed Julie. That is especially true after they discovered that Sam had already been in big trouble in the past. In fact, he had been arrested and tried for murder. He had been accused of luring a friend outside to a parking lot where he was killed by gang members. He was ultimately acquitted, but the thought is still that if he could do something like that once, he'd probably be willing to do it again, or at least have the capacity to do it again. So Sam's dad begins to conduct his own parallel investigation because he believes that Sam is a victim himself. He is the one who notices that someone in Long Beach is withdrawing money from a bank account that he shares with Sam. Sam had saved up $62,000 in combat pay. Steve goes there and hangs around and then gets an alert that the card is being used at a pizza place, and so he then goes to the pizza place looking for Sam's car, because the car, I guess, had also been missing from the apartment complex, which would add to the he fled thing. So the police also notice that there's activity on Sam's card and they actually have a lead over Steve, because they have access to the ATM cameras. The bank sends them the videos and they discover that it's not Sam but a kid. They kept using the term kid and he would be a kid, but he's more like a teenager, not a real young kid, and that kid is unknown to them, to Sam's parents, pretty much to everybody involved in the case. So the police go to the pizza place and they find out where the pizza was being delivered. They go to that address and they find out where the pizza was being delivered. They go to that address and they find Wesley Freilich. The police quickly realize that that is the teenager and that he isn't the killer, and that in doing a search, they find that Sam isn't in the house either. So Wesley tells the police that he got Sam's ATM card and pin number from a friend, an older guy that his mom had met in community theater, daniel Wozniak, who is the downstairs neighbor. Daniel told Wesley that Sam owed a bunch of money to a bail bondsman and he asked him to help withdraw money from an ATM. Apparently, daniel also had a folder with paperwork that showed that his scheme was legal, and the reporters in 2020, you know obviously pointed out that that's something that grown adults would not take seriously, but I I mean a teenager probably, certainly would.
Speaker 1:The police obviously want to talk to Daniel. They call him and tell him that they need to talk to him, but he blows them off. He tells them he's busy, that he's at his bachelor party. Okay, so the fact that he has a bachelor party, that there's a wedding coming up, that's a big deal in this case. So remember that. I don't think I said that before, but there is a big wedding, yeah. So the police go to him.
Speaker 1:He's arrested and taken into for interrogation. Well, one of the episodes says he was arrested in. One of the episodes says he was just taken down to be questioned. So I don't really know. He says that he's sick of covering for Sam and will tell them everything. So let's do a little background on Daniel. He was active in the community theater scene. He was described as fun and a good actor who always had money problems. At this point in time he was starring in the musical nine alongside his fiancee, rachel. Rachel was described as more serious and standoffish, which many saw as being rude and um same, I get told that I'm like that a lot too. Uh, neither had a job and needs cash to finance his wedding and honeymoon.
Speaker 1:So back to the interrogation. Daniel says he and Sam had a plan to withdraw funds from an ATM and Sam would report his account as stolen, he says, and then Sam would give him some money for his help. He says he doesn't know where Sam is, but he does admit to using the kid to take the money out of his account. So he admits to part of it. And when it comes to the time of Julie's murder, he says that he had had a performance that night. He had done well. He and Rachel had went home, he took a shower, they had sex. They go to sleep.
Speaker 1:The next morning he says Sam came over and told him that he did something bad, that he killed someone in a fit of rage. He tells them Sam threatened him and Rachel so he helped Sam escape. And that's the first story. Anyway, cops obviously don't believe him. At one point Daniel agrees to have his DNA collected. He starts to make excuses for why his DNA would be at the scene and it's here that he makes a critical mistake. So he tells them that he was in Sam's apartment the afternoon of the murder. Then he says he was in the room and saw Julie's body. Then he says he was next to the body but didn't touch her. The police finally ask what it was that he saw and he said I saw two gunshots to her head. So out of that paragraph, what is the mistake?
Speaker 2:I don't know because I don't remember what she said happened to her earlier, happened to her earlier.
Speaker 1:Okay, that's okay. Okay, so she had been, that's okay. She had been described as having a gunshot wound to the head, one gunshot wound to the head, and that is from the police, right? So the police are there and they were looking at the body very closely and they can only see one gunshot wound.
Speaker 2:So in order for he would have to have knowledge that they didn't have he would have to have knowledge.
Speaker 1:he either did it or he was in the room when it happened. So the police eventually end the interrogation and they send him off to his cell. While there, daniel makes a phone call to Rachel. During the call, rachel says she needs to talk to a detective because she found out that Daniel's brother, tim, is carrying around incriminating evidence and she wants to do this before the detectives listen to the call and think that she's trying to hide something. So she clearly knows that they listen to jailhouse calls.
Speaker 1:Daniel says something like I'm doomed, oh God, oh God, oh God. He says a bunch of other incriminating statements along the same lines and he tries to get her not to tell. And then he admits that the gun is part of the evidence that tim has. So she basically calls him an idiot because he said all of this on the phone which is being recorded. So he's basically admitted to murder and daniel tells the jailer that he needs to speak to a detective. He tells the detective that he's a pathological liar who couldn't admit to his fiance that he had no job, no money and was about to be evicted and could not afford to marry her. I should also point out that Rachel didn't have a job either, but Sam had all that money saved that $62,000 from his combat pay and he had actually offered to help Daniel pay for his wedding. And I should also point out too, it was only mentioned in one of the 2020s, but Daniel had borrowed money from a lot of people, so he owed a lot of money.
Speaker 1:But when Daniel figured out that Sam had $62,000, he felt like that would be problem solved. So Daniel tells the investigators that he killed Sam. First, he actually lured Sam to the Liberty Theater, the community theater, and he told Sam that he needed to get something from the attic. And while they are up there, daniel retrieved a gun and shot Sam in the back of the head. He said Sam was still alive and asking for help, and then Daniel shot him again. He tells the police that he decapitated Sam and cut off his hands, which can be found in plastic bags buried in shallow holes at a park. Why, yeah? What's even more disturbing is that he admits to the police that he was smiling and laughing while he did this.
Speaker 1:Now, he either actually was smiling and laughing or he was trying to set up like an insanity defense. Yeah, because he had been caught, I guess, saying something along those lines to Rachel.
Speaker 2:Did he say like why was he trying to prevent the body from being identified? Like, why did he cut off the hands and the head? That's probably why I mean they can still like DNA test.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but it would take longer, that's true.
Speaker 2:I mean, aren't they like, like, where's that missing person? You know, here's a body that matches, you know the, the height, and you know, like, build that person like even without a head, yeah, hands no, I know he's not.
Speaker 1:He's not thinking. I mean, I think when you're murdering someone, you're probably not thinking through all of the logistics. That's true, okay? So anyway, he takes Sam's phone and sends those odd texts to Julie asking her to come over, saying to come over alone, and whatever. Why, why didn't, why, why?
Speaker 2:would he want Julie to come over? Why would he need to kill Julie also?
Speaker 1:That's coming up. Hold on, all right, getting ahead of the game. Okay, so Daniel was waiting at the apartment and he and Julie went in and he asked her if she'd seen something in Sam's bed. She leaned over and he shot her twice in the back of the head. When asked why he would kill julie who's a near stranger he said it was to cover up sam's murder. He thought it would make it look like sam had raped and killed julie and then went on the run, which is exactly what happened. One yeah, that's so cold, I know it's one of of the reasons that I think this is one of the worst crimes. Once he killed Julie, he went to the rap party. Remember, he's in that musical. Nine 2020 actually showed a video of that rap party and you can see him smiling and laughing and it's actually really kind of disturbing if you know what he'd just done. Yeah, the police go to the park and look for sam's remains, which they find, and it was on sam's 27th birthday that they found his his remains.
Speaker 1:That's really fucked up yeah his body was so unrecognizable that he had to be identified by a tattoo on his chest, which was of a heart and a rose. That said mom and dad. Yeah, he may not have known there was a tattoo because it was on his chest. So, again, it was a heart and a rose. That said mom and dad.
Speaker 2:Murder is not logical. Don't do it. No, don't, don't.
Speaker 1:No, don't be dumb. The police also found a backpack with his ID passport and the gun that killed him. Once Daniel is arrested and it goes public, all kinds of people start to come forward, including a jazz musician named Chris Williams. Chris had loaned Daniel a lot of money and went to Daniel's apartment the day of the murders to collect it. He had told Daniel that it was mafia money or something along those lines, and was it? No, he told. I'm sure he told him that just so that Daniel would pay him back. Yeah, sam was at the apartment when Chris got there, and then Daniel and Sam left to go get the money.
Speaker 1:Chris stays with Rachel for three hours until Daniel finally gets back, but he's alone. Chris says that he seems to be almost hyperventilating and he basically throws $400 at Chris, says here's the money and then Chris leaves. So the police now want to know why Rachel didn't tell them about Chris, who was a very important potential witness At one point. They give her a voice stress test, which apparently can give the operator an idea of truthfulness. I don't know how it works exactly. I don't know. I doubt exactly. I don't know, I doubt it's admissible in court or anything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, you could be stressed for a number.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm sure talking to the police is stressful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was going to say I would be stressed to just talk to the cops.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I know, every time somebody says things like that I think of when I had my name legally changed and I had to go in front of the judge. Now, I did nothing wrong. I was just there to tell the judge why I wanted my name legally changed and I said my last name was my what did I say? My father-in-law's name? I wasn't married and it wasn't my father-in-law's name, it was my stepfather's name. Yeah, right, like, and it wasn't just a slip of the tongue. I was nervous, yeah, and again, I wasn't there for any horrible reason. Yeah, you know. So, yeah, I don't know how any of that stuff can be taken.
Speaker 1:Right, she apparently was soft-spoken and they do show the video. And she it was hard to hear her, yeah, and they felt that she was deceptive. She is eventually arrested as an accessory after the fact for lying to protect daniel. So it isn't just that she hid information, which is to say she didn't tell them about the three hours she spent with Chris Williams that day, right, but she actually provided the false information. Do you remember what that was? Rachel provided false information Along with Daniel. They both did. She corroborated it. No, I don't remember the guy in the black hat.
Speaker 2:Oh, yes, I remember I mentioned the guy in the black hat, but then I forgot about him.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so lying in case you don't know.
Speaker 2:Sorry, I'm not having a good short-term memory day today.
Speaker 1:That's okay. So that's another thing to remember. Folks, Don't lie for anybody. You can still be considered an accessory to murder. Not worth it Very much. Not worth it, no matter how much you think you love them. So Daniel wound up pleading not guilty. Not worth it very much. Not worth it, no matter how much you think you love them. So daniel wound up pleading not guilty.
Speaker 2:The trial lasted five days I mean imagine being in love with somebody who would hack somebody's head and hands off and bury them in a park and then shoot somebody twice in the back of the head, just so it seemed like that other person killed them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, no, I know there would be no love left. Yeah, and also, what makes it even more ick is that in some of the phone calls that they recorded, that they put on 2020, she asks him a series of questions like well, you don't have money, then why did you like move out of your parents house, or something like that. And he's like I was about to kill them. Yeah, yeah, he's like. And then she was like were you, did you ever think about killing me? And he goes no, never you. Yeah. And then she's like no, not you. No.
Speaker 1:And then at one point I don't remember the exact quote, but at one point she basically says like this is wrong, it's horrible, it's a terrible thing to do, it's disgusting, whatever. But I can also see why you did it for like you did it for me for our wedding and our honeymoon. I probably didn't. I didn't, I didn't make that clear. He wasn't just broke. He needed to pay for the wedding and he needed to pay for the honeymoon and he wanted to take her. He wanted to take her on like a really badass honeymoon well, what are they gonna do after the fucking honeymoon?
Speaker 2:Dude, he's not thinking.
Speaker 1:He's not thinking Clearly. Clearly I mean yeah, he's only thinking short term.
Speaker 2:Folks, a wedding is not about a fucking wedding and a honeymoon. It is about your marriage. Yeah, get over yourselves and go to the courthouse.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's what I did. You can have the party later. You can have the honeymoon later or not have one at all. Did you have one?
Speaker 2:no, I, yeah, I have kids, I have a honeymoon. Yeah, I don't think I know.
Speaker 1:I don't think I know anyone in my generation that had a honeymoon. We're all fucking poor. We can't afford to go on a honeymoon. We're all fucking poor.
Speaker 2:We can't afford to go on a honeymoon. Exactly Another fucking industry that millennials killed. Yeah, we killed the honeymoon industry.
Speaker 1:So he pleads not guilty despite the fact that he has confessed and he's led them to the body and whatever. He pleads not guilty and the trial lasts five days. It's actually a pretty quick trial, in part because one, the defense had no opening statement and called no witnesses, yeah, which is bonkers. You don't really see that happening too often, I don't. I don't think I could be wrong, but so basically it's just like we got nothing. Yeah, basically, it's just the prosecutor, matt Murphy, at the time up there like laying out every reason this guy is guilty.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Right, and it was actually a sight to behold Matt Murphy. He deserves the accolades. I think he was a pretty because I watch court TV and I see and I watch a lot of trials and stuff. I think he was. He's probably one of the better ones, not probably he is one of the better ones. Anyway, okay, now that I'm I fawned over Matt.
Speaker 2:Murphy Okay. Kb says I declare murphy okay.
Speaker 1:Kb says I declare oh my god, I'm gonna be so embarrassed if he ever listens to this. I mean, I don't think he would ever listen to no, no, no, I don't need to be embarrassed, I'm already embarrassed. I'm blushing. Nobody can tell that, but I'm blushing, can you, we? I mean, I do need to put this stuff on YouTube, but if we actually started recording, like doing video recordings, our faces would be so red Well, my face would be red like 90% of the time, it's true.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Okay, and I have a little smirk, I think.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm. Yeah, maybe we'd come off better.
Speaker 2:People could see our facial expressions. I turned red. I think that time you talked about the Spock harem, the what, the Spock harem I don't remember that what. That was like a couple, I don't know how many episodes we were talking about all the different versions of Spock, and we're talking about spock harem.
Speaker 1:Oh, oh, oh oh. I think that one made me blush. I thought you said speculum. I was like no, jesus, what the spock no, speculum does not make me blush no, I wouldn't think so. That's why that's why j Christ, that's why I was confused. That's why I was confused. Yeah, that did make you blush.
Speaker 2:Speculum is like the opposite of hot.
Speaker 1:I know. No, I know, I know. I mean for some people it's not. There is a whole. Why am I doing this? This is the reading of slut material coming out here, but there is a whole sub-genre of medical play, and a lot of that involves speculants. Yeah, I don't know why any woman would find that I mean not to yuck anybody's yum, but it is not a pleasant experience.
Speaker 2:No, no, to me it's not nice no, it's painful, yeah, honestly it's it's.
Speaker 1:It's painful at worst, it's un very uncomfortable at best yeah, and there's like a whole gymnastics thing you got into. Why am I talking about this? Tune in to hear more about our cervix. Anyway, there's some medical play.
Speaker 2:Now, you're really rough, oh God.
Speaker 1:Okay, there's medical play. It's uncomfortable, in case there are any men out there listening when your wife or lady comes home from that doctor give her some ice cream, yeah or some snackies, give her a kiss on the forehead, tell her she's a good girl and then leave her alone all right, now that I'm done, embarrassing both of ourselves. Spock harem specula. Oh, my god. Okay, what was the spock hair?
Speaker 2:oh, because you, you like all the spocks yeah, we were talking about how all the different versions of spock are sexy in their own way, yeah, yeah, okay, I remember, I remember, I apologize, I apologize.
Speaker 1:I remember my own embarrassing moments.
Speaker 2:I don't include yours, sorry, Well, I wanted to include it because I wanted to you know even the playing field here a little bit. Yes, I, appreciate that.
Speaker 1:I appreciate that I was just thinking. I think that's the only time I've ever embarrassed you in the like 15 years we've known each other yeah, perhaps I you want to hear, you want to hear an embarrassing, I don't even.
Speaker 2:I can't even remember exactly what I said. But but you, I have a smart mouth and I, I was, I was in like history class and I remember I said something. I was trying to make a dig at this dude but people like took it the wrong way and they thought that I was into him. And then the teacher made fun of me. I was like, no, no, that's not what I meant, and it was terrible. I wanted to die. Oh yeah, it was like a million years ago, though I don't even remember exactly what I said that's horrible the teacher made fun of you.
Speaker 2:Yes, no the teacher was an asshole yeah, sounds like it, god, yeah, no.
Speaker 1:the only really embarrassing school thing I can remember is saying orgasm instead of organism and not knowing what that was, because I was a very naive child.
Speaker 2:I did that too, but thankfully only to my older sister and not to like at school. Yeah no, but I had plenty of embarrassing moments at school as well.
Speaker 1:I probably did too.
Speaker 2:I just and I only went to public school for four years.
Speaker 1:So I'm sure I have more. I just blocked them. I'm very good at blocking things, Nice. Okay, now that we're done embarrassing ourselves. So againiel pled not guilty. The trial lasted five days. Defense had no opening, no witnesses, basically it's just mr murphy laying out why he did it and why he's guilty and in their closing the defense's closing they never actually used the words innocent and never asked for a not guilty verdict. And actually one of the jurors says the trial was never about whether or not he was guilty. Yeah, I think most of it was for the sentencing phase, which is crazy. I mean, I guess I don't know what defense they could make it's difficult.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I mean, he confessed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he did it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that's a toughie, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, so the jury found him guilty. And then, since California is a death penalty state, although at the moment there's a moratorium on the death penalty they still had. At the time there wasn't a moratorium and they had to decide whether or not Daniel should be sentenced to death.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Mr Murphy argues for it. Obviously the defense says look, he's reformed while he's in prison. It's been about five years. It was a very long wait between arrest and trial and helping other prisoners. And they also blame Rachel, claiming that she manipulated him or something. I didn't really. They blame her. Yeah, Well, rachel's also on trial or will be on trial.
Speaker 2:Well, that's understandable.
Speaker 1:That's a typical thing of blaming the other. That's a typical defense.
Speaker 2:But like she didn't seem like she was involved in the premeditation of the crime.
Speaker 1:There's actually, if you listen to the tapes and you watch the, we'll talk about that in a minute. Okay, hold on. Okay, I wasn't impressed with the closing arguments, although they only showed like 10 seconds of it. So the defense says look, oh wait, I already said that he's reformed and he is actually helping other prisoners.
Speaker 2:He's become a christian, whatever I mean, that's just, that's just an argument too yeah, but I mean I, agree, I don't.
Speaker 1:I don't believe in the death penalty, so yeah but I don't think that's why they said he was christian. Sure, yeah, again, they blame rachel. Rachel at first. The jury when they go back is 10-2 for the death penalty, but then the two holdout jurors think about that, right, like they. They actually brought up a point that my grandmother brought up back when new mexico had the death penalty and she, she had a trial like that. It's one thing to in theory before the death penalty. It's another thing when you're the one who has to make that choice. Yeah, because you are essentially sending somebody to you're.
Speaker 1:You are the executioner. You may not actually press the button or whatever, but, right, you are sending them to death and that's a hard thing for a lot of people. I it should be a hard thing for people. Even if the person is a monster, it's because you are a good person. It should still be, I think, a question, at least a question that you need to think about.
Speaker 1:Anyway, those two dudes thought about it. I think they were dudes and what they said was they thought about their family and the family's testimonies. When you're doing it's basically both sides you want to bring in people to the defense, wants to bring in people to show that he's a good person, blah, blah, blah. The prosecution side wants to bring in the families and tell them how horrible this whole experience has been. What their children, children, what their loved one was like right.
Speaker 1:And so julie's mom I think her name is june and steve, you know brought in pictures like of the funeral. They brought in pictures of them when they were kids or whatever right, and they see the like, raw emotion, even though it's been five years, the very raw emotion, and the jurors said that they thought about that and when they went to vote a second time, it was a unanimous 12-12 for the death penalty. Oddly, or maybe not oddly, it took less than an hour for them to come to this conclusion which, according to 2020, at least the first 2020, back in 2016 or whatever, said that it was the shortest death penalty deliberations on record.
Speaker 1:So, despite that, when the jurors are talking about it, you can really tell that they didn't make the decision lately. As I was saying before, it may have been quick, but I think it shows that they again years later at that point I guess it would be weeks later, but they also talked about it in the second 2020, which would have been years after that that they really thought about it and searched within themselves to see if they would be okay with it. Rachel's trial takes place two years after daniel's. She was found guilty on two counts of accessory after the fact and sentenced to 32 months in jail. I believe she got out in 2019. There was something else, um, but I don't remember. Anyway. That was, I think, one of the worst murders probably that I've heard of, simply because of the fact that he used an innocent young lady in order to cover up his own crime and besmirch.
Speaker 2:Sorry, excuse me, I burped.
Speaker 1:And besmirched a by all accounts decent young man's name, yeah, Making him into a rapist and a killer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's horrific, just for 60,000 bucks.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, so he can take his fiancée on a honeymoon. That's madness, it is madness on a honeymoon?
Speaker 2:that's madness, it is madness. Uh, you were gonna tell me about evidence that suggested that that the fiance was involved oh, oh yeah.
Speaker 1:It's not really evidence, so she was never charged with it and I don't know that anybody thinks really that she was involved in the planning yeah but the question is how much she knew, yeah, after the fact, and actually there may be some question about it maybe he didn't tell her that he murdered anybody, but she didn't tell them about that jazz musician, right? So she clearly at least suspected something, right? And that is against the law to do that, right? But again, that can go either way. It can show that she maybe, yeah, that could show that maybe she suspects it or she knew ahead of time.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:And kept that musician busy for those three hours interesting, like she knew that he like yeah, at least he was up to something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, something no good. Yeah, even if it's just, I'm gonna go take care of this money thing. Yeah, like that's still information.
Speaker 1:Also they kind of point to like some of the things she said in the phone calls, but also her very detached manner.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know, now I again don't know how much stock I would put in that personally, because I come off the same way a lot of the time, right In the middle of emergencies or when I am feeling an extreme emotion other than annoyance. Annoyance, you can tell I'm annoyed, but in any other way I come off as being detached.
Speaker 2:Disassociation is a common shock response.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and even months later, remembering something or thinking about something painful, you can become detached from it, and I certainly do that and I can certainly see. If I were in a similar situation and I were completely innocent, didn't know anything and wasn't covering, I could still see myself being detached or possibly being detached. Obviously, I have no idea I could be a crying mess for all I know, but just judging from my own past experiences I could come off as very detached.
Speaker 2:I certainly come off as rude sometimes to people yeah, you know, no, people think I come off as rude.
Speaker 1:Yeah, sometimes yeah, without saying anything, I just look like I'm. I just look like I'm rude, apparently, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2:Or if I'm just being firm about like what, like yeah, like I'm stating something, like I'm going to do this, or you know, apparently that's rude, Like I don't know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like. Well, that I think gets into sexismism because women aren't supposed to do those things.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was going to say, but this is more like she looks like.
Speaker 1:she comes off as being like maybe a little shy, maybe not shy, but like quiet and reserved and for whatever reason, a lot of people turn that into rude. I've been told that too standoffish and rude. Really, I'm just a very anxious person and probably trying not to make a complete idiot out of myself. I'm not trying to be rude. If you came up and talked to me, I'd give you a big smile and I'd do my best to take part in a conversation. It'd be very awkward because I don't.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, I'm so bad at like small talk.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can't, I don't do small talk, well at all, but you know, it's not a lot of people. It's not a lot of people. Most people think correctly, that I'm just a little bit reserved or just a little bit quiet, maybe even even shy. But there are people who take an instant dislike to me because they think I'm being rude, because I'm not the life of the party, you know I think that's such a weird take.
Speaker 2:Like people are different, yeah, no, they're not gonna have the same and we shouldn't expect that everybody has the same responses or the same enthusiasm. I don't know, I think that kind of fits into this weird corporate capitalist kind of thing where we expect we want everybody to have this same like weird hyper-enthusiastic kind of, you know, like extrovert, outgoing go-get-em leader, whatever personality. Yeah, so it seems weird and the thing is that most people are putting on a work sauna or whatever.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's all fake, but you know some people can't, some people are just good at it it and some people can't. Exactly, I can't fake enthusiasm, right, chances are. If there is a crowd, if it's a party. I am doing my best not to have a panic attack. Yeah, that is what's happening, not because I'm worried about anybody judging me, but because I have a phobia. So I'm just trying really, really hard not to pass out, right, you know. But you know that. Yeah, I guess for those of us that have those issues the often being misunderstood issues I think we're probably a little more sensitive to that. I don't look at somebody and go that person's rude. Yeah, I'm like maybe that person has a phobia, just like me. Yeah, and if I weren't trying to keep myself from passing out, maybe I'd go over and talk to her, make a new friend.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, I think maybe that person's neurodivergent, because we all have our different like perceptions. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:Although I can also see how people judge immediately, like to be honest. So I've been aware of this case since probably 2012, 2013. Like it was after the murder happened and he was arrested, but I'm pretty sure it was before the trial and there was some sort of show. It wasn't 2020. It wasn't Dateline. It was one of those true crime shows that are more on the ick spectrum than on the okay spectrum right, what do you mean ick spectrum? Okay spectrum, right. What do you mean? X spectrum like so? I like true crime there's, it's on it. There's like a I would call it a spectrum. There is the high quality stuff that is very careful with the victims and the victims families, and there are the ones that are like you you look at it and you're entertained, but you're like that's a little uncomfortable yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Okay, I get what you're saying, like it's cringy, it's it's it's low, like yeah low brow, yeah, I guess you could say, yes, low brow.
Speaker 1:So I think, if I'm remembering correctly, it was one of those and but they still show like actual pictures of people, right? So they showed an actual picture of him. They hadn't said anything. I had no idea that was the killer when I saw that picture, but I remember thinking, just from the picture that guy's creepy, yeah, like that, like I'm, I wouldn't want to be anywhere near this guy. And it turns out he was the killer, right, and yet so many people fell for his.
Speaker 1:You know fun, fun-loving, laughing all the time persona, you know, yeah, but anyway, his image stuck with me just because of that immediate reaction. Like I didn't know his name until like a couple of years ago. I didn't know the killer's name, but I remembered his face. Like I don't know if you've had this You've seen cases or you've come across cases and maybe you don't remember everything, but snippets of it pop into your brain every once in a while and you're thinking about something else completely and then it just pops into your head. That was this case for me. So like I didn't really know the details until a few years ago and even now, doing this last night. I had forgotten a lot of it, but it is one of those cases that popped up every so often, randomly, and his image would pop up in my head. I don't really see images or people in my brain ever.
Speaker 1:We've talked about that before talking about, right, okay, so you don't know what I'm talking about. I can't come up with images in my brain at all, like if I close my eyes and you ask me to imagine a chair, I couldn't do it. I wouldn't, I wouldn't know how. Like, intuitively, I know what a chair is, but I couldn't conjure up an image. And I definitely can't conjure up faces, even your face. I've known you for 15 years. We see each other all the time if I was asked to describe you.
Speaker 2:I couldn't, I couldn't there's a word for like face blindness well, it is face blindness, but it's not entirely face blindness.
Speaker 1:It's like it's everything. Um. Right, it's like when I read a book I don't see images in my head either, anyway. But the reason I'm bringing that up is because his image, though blurry, pops up in my head. It's a little blurry, but it's clear for me in the sense that nothing else is clear. Right, and that's startling. You know, that's stuck with me. I don't know, I don't know why I brought that up, but it's weird.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, that's creepy.
Speaker 1:It is creepy. Do you have one like that?
Speaker 2:Not that I can think of off the top of my head, but since I have slow, since we're talking about brain stuff, I have really slow mental processing speed. My mental processing speed is in like the 10th percentile. I think we've talked about that before, but I don't know if we've talked about on the podcast. So sometimes I don't like think of it's, it's hard, it like it doesn't come to me right away and then like, so maybe it'll occur to me like something later okay, that is like that yeah, so okay, so that is huh, that, uh, that one.
Speaker 2:I was telling you about a week or two ago about that kid who maybe got drowned or got eaten by the sharks or whatever. What was his name I already forget.
Speaker 1:Oh, the kid that jumped off the boat, the kid that jumped off the boat.
Speaker 2:Yep, I was telling you, watch out, don't jump off the boat. Right, there was, like you know, like people were trying to like analyze the image and there is one analysis like I don't know if it was like just the way that they whatever like because they were putting the image like zooming in and putting it through like different, like different light filters or whatever, but it did really look to me like the shape of a bull shark's snout that was real square and that image really freaked me out. Yeah, because I was like I can't see anything. I can't see anything. And then, all of a sudden, I could see, like the shape and I was like, oh shit, like not only could I see the shape of the shark's head, but it distinctly looked like a bull shark head or I'm sorry, not a bull shark head, a tiger shark. I'm sorry, I don't know why I'm saying bull shark head. It looked like a tiger shark head, because a tiger shark has, like, a very squared head.
Speaker 2:I don't know why I was saying bull shark. It was because, see, this is another thing that I do, I get things mixed up, because it's like shark month or whatever. Also, it's ice cream month and shark month, and there was a thing saying what kind of shark would you be? And I was thinking, well, I would either be like a bull shark or a poor beagle, because those are fat sharks. So I had like the thought of a bull shark in my head. No, and there are quite a bit of bull sharks in that area as well A bull shark has a very damn it.
Speaker 2:I'm doing it again. It's okay, 's okay. A tiger, a tiger shark has a very squared head and like. So when you see it head on, it's like this rectangular snout shape right, and that was the shape that I saw and it flips. Flipped you out, yeah, freaked you out, yeah it did freak me out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was like it's coming up and it's it's getting him. Yeah, it may have been just a shape again. You know, like they were doing all these filters and like it's really fucking hard to see like what the fuck is going on, right?
Speaker 1:but, but it's still something that sticks with you, yeah.
Speaker 2:I really I recognized that shape and I was like, wow, that's it, there's the shark, I see it yeah. Yeah, Don't sue me somebody.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, so you're missing person.
Speaker 2:Yes, let's go over that. So you're missing person. Yes, let's go over that. I remember how you were saying, like how we don't get a lot of news from Albuquerque. This is like one of them. This seems to have been like a big Albuquerque story and I don't remember hearing about it.
Speaker 1:You would think they would want it down here in case, like in case she ran away or something Right, or she came down here.
Speaker 2:So if this sounds familiar to you, let me know. So it says family desperate for answers. In search of albuquerque woman in jamez springs, 37 year old ingrid lane, has been reported missing since Sunday, october 15, 2023. According to the local authorities, lane was last seen on Freeway 144, 11 miles north of Highway 126, traveling in a black 2019 Subaru Impreza hatchback. Her vehicle was found abandoned with a broken rear window at the same location on Thursday, october 18, 2023.
Speaker 2:According to family members, lane visited a meditation center in Jemez Spring days before she was reported missing to unwind from the stressors of life. According to Ingrid's husband, louis Scuderi, she's my person I don't know how to better put it than that Scuderi told KOAT. He described his wife as one of a kind, a love unmatched. She left the house very early in the morning, around 5 to 5.30 in the morning. She told me she was going to the Bodhi Amanda Zen Center in Jemez Springs, where she's lived up before, stayed many times and even stayed over there the week before convenience. I don't know what that means. Oh, for convenience, because she works up in Los Alamos every once in a while. Ingrid Lane's husband, louis Guderi, said I thought nothing of it and in fact I was very encouraging of her going up there to do a meditation retreat. She'd had some struggles recently so I thought that's a great idea. I just thought she's up there. She's unplugged from her phone, I'm not going to interrupt that, but come it was it Tuesday I think. I called her mom and a couple of friends who hadn't heard from her. I was starting to get worried. First thing Wednesday morning I called the Zen Center and they said she had been there, probably at 8 or 9 am that Sunday, but had left.
Speaker 2:Skidari said we chatted on Friday. We had this great conversation, according to Inga Sorry, they kind of abruptly switched perspectives to her twin sister, kelsey Lane. She said we chatted on Friday and we had this great conversation. She was talking about her plans for the future. She was thinking about a different graduate program and she was talking about plans to maybe go visit one of our cousins who's one of her favorite people. We didn't talk over the weekend so I didn't think anything of it.
Speaker 2:Ingrid Lane's twin sister, kelsey Lane, told KOAT she's incredible. We're identical twins. We're very close, lane told KOAT. I have not felt her presence the same way since. I'm trying not to read into that, but it definitely makes me sad. It makes me worry. I just hope she's okay. Lane told KOAT.
Speaker 2:I felt the strongest urge to call her on Monday afternoon, like gosh, I need to talk to Ingrid right now. I called her and it went straight to voicemail. So I thought, okay, she must not have her phone on. She's been going to the Zen Center. Her phone doesn't even work. You hit him at Springs and it stops working From there on it didn't work at all. So I thought, okay, that's weird. We'll connect tomorrow. I'm sure she'll call me back tomorrow.
Speaker 2:But then Wednesday morning Lewis filed the missing persons report. Lane said Authorities find Lane's car abandoned on October 18th. It's a mystery that keeps deepening. Scuderi told KOAT what we had learned later. When they were towing her car, a few hunters flagged down the people who were towing it and said they had actually talked to her on Sunday about around 2 pm. The report was she had a flat tire and the back window of her car was smashed out. At that time she told them she had messed up her car and she was looking to get to the top of the mountains. Gidary said it's clear she didn't make it up the road and having seen pictures of it. I would not have tried to go up it so it looks like she backed down off of the road. Skidary said she had such a zest on life. Lane said I never knew a heart could hurt so badly.
Speaker 2:Ingrid's mother, rebecca Lane, told KOAT they are leaning on the strength of prayers to get them through Lane's sudden disappearance. She expressed vivid memories shared during family outings and Lane's birthday prior to her reported missing. Lane described her daughter as outgoing, strong, loving and caring. I'm putting one foot in front of the other and breathing. I can't not have some hope, but I am realistic. We did a bunch of stuff. We were an outdoor family. We skied, hiked and kayaked. She loved kayaking. She always stood up for the underdog. She also advocated for the LGBTQ plus community. She wanted to get more people into the STEM pipeline. Lane told KOAT my last text to her was I love you, and I see it was delivered. Lane told KOAT she had some health struggles. She struggled because of her lungs. Lane's mother told KOAT I've said please take time to just rest and catch up. She had to struggle so hard at birth. I don't know if she ever got a chance to learn how to read her body as well as she should and find the rest that's needed and take time.
Speaker 2:The New Mexico State Police were first notified mid-afternoon on Thursday of 10-19-20-23 by Sandoval County that Ingrid Layden's vehicle had been located on Forest Road 144, 11 miles north of New Mexico, 126 west of La Cueva. An SAR search and rescue investigation was started and initial inquiries regarding the circumstances suggested that it had likely been there since Sunday of the 15th. Despite the significant elapsed time, new Mexico search and rescue canine teams were requested for Friday on the 20th to conduct a search of the vehicle and attempt to determine the direction of travel from the vehicle. An incident command post was established near the vehicle location and two canine teams and one ground team searched the area within approximately a half mile around the vehicle location and two canine teams and one ground team searched the area within approximately a half mile around the vehicle. Tracking indicated the subject had probably spent time in the area south and east of the vehicle, but no direction of travel out of the area was detected. The search was suspended Friday night pending further investigation. Suspended Friday night pending further investigation.
Speaker 2:On Saturday night of the 21st, two hunters saw the vehicle being recovered by Sandoval County and stated that they had assisted Ingrid the previous weekend at the vehicle location. They reported she had declined a ride out of the area and indicated she planned to hike further up freeway 144 to see if she could get a ride further up the road. That was the last confirmed sighting. Based on that information, a broader search was initiated on sunday of the 22nd. 10 teams comprising of canine, ground and drones and approximately 35 search and rescue personnel focused on Freeway 144 North. Further dog interest was noted in the area, but no clues and no direction of travel was definitively established within two miles of the vehicle and the search was suspended again on Sunday night.
Speaker 2:Missing persons flyers were distributed in La Cueva to attempt to generate more specific, actionable information. According to Pete Dixon, MSP field coordinator. According to Sandoval Sheriff's Office, they don't suspect foul play. Search dogs and drones have been used to locate Lane, but to no avail. As of Thursday November 6th, the Sheriff's Office, state police and New Mexico Search and Rescue are collaborated in the search for Lane. Authorities encourage anyone with information on Lane's disappearance to come forward.
Speaker 2:Okay, and I did give that information earlier, but if anyone has any information about the whereabouts of Ingrid, they are encouraged to contact the Albuquerque Police Department at 505-424-2677. And I did have some information. Another information, briefly, from another story. It's a audio story so I wasn't able to listen to it, but there's a brief synopsis. Update from May 27th of this year, said seven months after Ingrid Lane's disappearance on a hike near Jemez Springs. Her aunt, carol Jo Eng, and her mother, rebecca Lane, continue to search in the Valle Grande. Rebecca Lane believes her daughter became lost and died. She had had COVID, she had impaired lungs. Her car was left at 1,900 feet elevation. I think that she just got lost somewhere and she's somewhere in the wilderness and has passed away.
Speaker 1:Oh.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that sounds like it is likely what occurred so that's really horrific.
Speaker 2:It is, but hopefully some information can be found on what happened and, yeah uh, the whereabouts of her, or likely her, remains so that her family can have some peace yeah so if you have any information regarding those whereabouts or if you are in that area and happen to find human remains while it sounds really morbid, but yeah, contact the Albuquerque Police Department. Yeah, so Okay, I wonder. Yeah, it seems like she was not well, because I wonder why she decided to decline the ride and said she was going to hike further up to see if she could get a ride up the road, like why not take the ride? Yeah, that you were being offered right then, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1:Maybe she didn't feel comfortable with the, that's true person that's.
Speaker 2:That's true usually. That's true. I often don't like to take rides from men.
Speaker 1:Yeah so. Even once I know yeah, thank you for that. Yeah, that was sad. It is sad. Do we have any gossipy stuff, any books we're reading, watching, listening to?
Speaker 2:Before that, I wanted to briefly mention just rest in peace about Sonia Massey. I'm sure everybody's heard about her and what happened to her, which is awful and horrific and it's very frustrating. It seems very frustrating when it feels like it's been so long that people are calling for action and change and it feels like substantive change. Changes have not been made, especially with this officer, like having had so many issues in the past and having moved from so many different departments in the past and this has happened a lot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's happened with people who have killed people and gotten, you know, not been charged and then they were able to move departments again and find work and the only slight encouragement, you know, is that this officer was immediately arrested and charged, you know is that this officer was immediately arrested and charged, but like that's only one piece of it, like like this needs to not happen at all, you know, yeah, and measures to prevent this from happening, from preventing like officers with these types of disciplinary issues from continuing to serve on the force for one, that would be a big fucking start.
Speaker 2:I think that's just the tip of the iceberg. You know I've voiced my opinion on that in the past but yeah, it's just really horrific and like just completely unnecessary and awful way to die, and you know the thoughts are.
Speaker 1:Do I have any thoughts? Yeah, no, I agree with you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I know, I know, but.
Speaker 1:I don't have anything profound to say. Yeah, I wonder what the hiring practices are in that state. Yeah, because in some states you can't tell the next employer anything negative about that person, unless they specifically ask something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a different kind of standard when there's, like you know, you would think yeah no, I would agree with you.
Speaker 1:You would think it's just a thought. I'm not. I I don't know if the police or the the fire department would be under that stuff, or if they just look the other way. It just reminded me of yeah of no, I don't know that isn't interesting.
Speaker 1:That is an interesting uh because if that question, because if that's the case, then there definitely needs to be reform in that area as well. There should always be reform. I mean, I understand wanting to protect workers and the fact that workers get unfairly fired all of the time for dumb shit. You know, like you're not supposed to fire somebody for being gay, you're not supposed to fire somebody for being a woman, whatever, but that doesn't mean that you aren't being fired for those reasons.
Speaker 1:They're just finding a different one so I understand that those, exactly those type of laws are there to protect those people. But they fortunately don't. But in some cases they don't yeah when it, when it becomes a real issue, it is not yeah.
Speaker 2:And I do want to you know acknowledge that again.
Speaker 1:Like I said, that's just the tip of the iceberg. Okay, so on a lighter note, yeah, have you been reading watching? I mean, I know you read Piglet.
Speaker 2:Yes, I read piglet and the author let me find the author's name, because I I do highly recommend it. Uh, if you are like me and lottie hazel uh, it's like hazel, but with two l's. If you are like me and have I've been enjoying some stories about, like I said, women losing their shit in a wonderful way, then then you might enjoy this, but with a, with a caveat trigger warning for eating disorder yeah, so have you watched anything?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, just uh. Deep space nine. I have been meaning to watch alien covenant that's on hulu, but I haven't. If I watch a movie, I need to it has to be during the daytime, because otherwise I'm just gonna fall asleep right, yeah, and that's what I've been doing. I've been been not watching deep space nine yeah, you've been falling asleep to Deep Space.
Speaker 1:Nine I've been watching the opening of Deep Space Nine and then falling asleep.
Speaker 2:One of these days, if I have any spare time, which, yeah, I'm now homeschooling one of my children, my son. One of my children, my son, yeah, so I I just the school he was going to I through 8 and have not been a fan of homeschooling and have generally felt like it's not right for most. Of course, my parents homeschooled me from like a religious perspective, things like that, but in the circumstance of of my son, when public school is not not willing or able to make adequate accommodations for him and when he's not benefiting from the socialization aspect, let's just, you know, I don't want to go into details, you know.
Speaker 1:He just he isn't benefiting from what the people think that he should be.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 2:And he needs different accommodations and they aren't willing to entertain that idea Exactly, aren't willing to entertain that idea Exactly, and so, yeah, so we've been doing that for one week and it is hard and stressful, and being, yeah, my son's teacher is, yeah, it's definitely challenging, but I feel it's the best move. Yeah, I feel good knowing that he's safe, other children are safe and, yeah, that, yeah, and maybe in the future that he might be ready again to go to public school. So I hope so. Yeah, like I hope this is not indefinite, right, like, because I'm very tired.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, well, it's work. Teaching is work. People don't realize how exhausting teaching actually is. Yeah, yeah realize how exhausting teaching actually is. Yeah, yeah, even even when the student is, you know everything you could ask for in a student. Uh, it just it's exhausting.
Speaker 2:This is why he this is what he needs, that he needs one-on-one yeah, absolutely one of the things that they would not give him. Yeah, and so, like it's one of it's something that they say that they give, but in two years I've been trying to get it and they won't give it to him, right? So yeah, frustrating it's yeah, just putting other kids at risk and putting him at risk. Yeah, because they don't you know they're, they don't want to accommodate him and they don't want to understand.
Speaker 1:Yeah they can't see the force they don't want to understand his, him being dysregulated when they can't accommodate his needs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so yeah, yeah, that's what's going on with me. Yeah, and yeah, and yeah, I read that one book. I started another book, like I said, it's just like a novella. It's called Cold Water Veins by Amy Lukaviks. Ooh, water Veins by Amy Lukaviks, and it's kind of like a. These two sisters have been this kind of isolated farming community and their mother supposedly killed herself, and them and their father left the community. Only when they're adults they find out that their mother had killed herself, and and they them and their father left the community. Only when they're adults they find out that their mother had killed herself, but now she is really dead, and so they had missed out on knowing her this whole time, and so now they've inherited this farm and they've gone back, and I think weird things are about to be afoot nice, nice, let's see.
Speaker 1:I haven't read anything. Surprise, surprise to no one. I just I haven't been in a headspace so I've been watching. I haven't really been watching any TV but I keep going down the YouTube. Well, booktube rabbit hole, let's see. So, yeah, booktubeube mainly, and haven't really listened to anything, I guess since the last time I did watch. Megan kelly has a show. I don't usually watch her, but she had. She has a series, I think, on like fraud, crimes or something, and she had one on the other crime I want to do, ed shin. So so I watched that one, watched slash, listened to because it's also a podcast.
Speaker 2:I listened to a book podcast.
Speaker 1:Ooh, a book podcast.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's the podcast of the guy. Is his name David or Daniel? He's the male podcaster from Maintenance Phase and he's got a. It's called like Books on Raw. I want to say, hmm, interesting. I listened to his podcast on Hillbilly Elegy. That's what I was talking to you about. Oh yeah, because they had done it like some years ago and then they like, updated some information and re-released it. Yeah, because of the VP nomination yeah.
Speaker 1:Anything else? I don't think, so that is not an endorsement, by the way.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:If anybody listens to this and thinks that's an endorsement, they haven't been listening.
Speaker 2:If anybody listens to this and thinks that's an endorsement. They haven't been listening. It is an endorsement of that podcast, but it's not an endorsement of Hillbilly Elegy or of JD Vance. Right, right.
Speaker 1:No, and let's see. Okay, so nothing. Our next book is Little Crazy Children by James Renner.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:That will be sometime in september, I believe. I will have the exact date on the um, or at least the episode is episode 24 and I'll have that up in the show notes and we will also post it on instagram if you would be so kind as to like, subscribe, download all that fun stuff, send me an email. Send an email.
Speaker 2:Be our internet friends God.
Speaker 1:Right, give me your tots. And yeah, I guess that's it. We are off to see Twister. Yeah, twisters, twisters. We're off to see Glenn Powell, who is well, I can't decide if he's attractive or punchable.
Speaker 2:I think he looks pretty punchable, but his dog is cute. I might steal his dog. His dog is absolutely adorable, brisket.
Speaker 1:I'm going to cut that part out. Anyway, I'm not really going to steal his dog. No, I don't mean that part. I meant me calling him attractive or punchable.
Speaker 2:You don't have to cut that out. He's like an act. It's okay, like I know. I know really graphic or like no I.
Speaker 1:I will never shy away from anything graphic. You know that well, sure I mean, come on, we just talked about speculums, we're not really gonna punch him. Okay, I don't think that either. It's just embarrassing to me. I'm turning red again. Um, okay, so little crazy children like subscribe. Review down is your gynecologist.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry, it's okay, I couldn't resist.
Speaker 1:He would. Maybe he'd play a gynecologist. I haven't seen his backlog. Maybe he has. Okay, so like subscribe. Like subscribe, follow, download, write emails. Uh, you know, we, we have our personal emails and our our podcast, not emails. Personal instagrams uh, podcast stuff all in the show notes hashtag glenn powell is my gynecologist jesus christ okay, and we are off and we will talk to you next time.
Speaker 2:Bye.
