Details Are Sketchy
A bimonthly true crime podcast, in which two friends share an unsolved disappearance or unsolved case, a crime they're most intrigued by, and talk all things true crime.
Details Are Sketchy
It Takes Two: Sante and Kenny Kimes Jr.
In this episode, Kiki brings us the crimes of Sante and Kenny Kimes Jr., and Rachel tells us about Anthonette Christine Cayedito who has been missing since 1986. We also talk about what we've been reading and watching.
Note: Kiki has the wrong episode again (what else is new). We will actually be discussing our next book two episodes from this one (episode 36).
Our next book is "The Dinosaur Artist: Obsession, Betrayal, and the Quest for Earth's Ultimate Trophy" by Paige Williams.
Sources:
Sante and Kenny Kimes Jr.
Diabolical Women "Sante Kimes" (Episode 1)
Wikipedia "Sante Kimes"
Anthonette Christine Cayedito
FBI Missing Persons "Anthonette Christine Cayedito" https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/kidnap/anthonette-christine-cayedito
Unsolved "Anthonette Cayedito" https://unsolved.com/gallery/anthonette-cayedito/
Get in touch with us:
Instagram: Details Are Sketchy - @details.are.sketchy
Facebook: Details Are Sketchy - @details.are.sketchy.2023
Instagram: Kiki - @kikileona84
Instagram: Rachel - @eeniemanimeenienailz
Email: details.are.sketchy.pod@gmail.com
I'm Kiki. And I'm Rachel and this is Details are Sketchy A true crime podcast, and I'm not even going to pretend I know what episode this is anymore, but I do know the next one is our book one. Okay, I believe it's our book one. Yeah, so I think this is 33. That's what I want to say. Or episode I don't know, three or four in the second season, and let me, I think I might just stop saying episode numbers, right.
Speaker 2:Okay, let me. Our book is going to be the Dinosaur Artist by Paige Williams.
Speaker 1:Okay, I ordered it. It's not coming until next week, if you want to listen along. Follow along, follow along.
Speaker 2:Follow along, yeah.
Speaker 1:Hear our thoughts. Read the book.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they'll listen along to our commentary on it.
Speaker 1:There you go this week. You're doing the Missing Person, yes, and I am doing the Case.
Speaker 2:Yep, okay, so I should take it away.
Speaker 2:It so I should take it away. Yes, it's my turn to take it away. I chose, with like five minutes preparation a case. It's a cold case from the FBI most wanted list A missing child. She list a missing child. She's not a child anymore. She went missing on April 6, 1986.
Speaker 2:Her name Anthonette Christine Cayedito, and she went missing from Gallup, new Mexico. And, yeah, her information. Her date of birth December 25th 1976. Her hair is brown. Her height at the time of her disappearance was 4'7". Her sex female.
Speaker 2:Nationality American. I don't know why that's necessary to put that. Place of birth, new Mexico. Eyes brown. Weight, 55 pounds at the time of her disappearance. Her race biracial, native American. And white Scars and marks Kaya Ditto has freckles, pierced ears, a scar on her knee and a scar on her lip. Ears, a scar on her knee and a scar on her lip. She has moles on her back, right cheek, nose, left and right hands and her right ankle. Remarks Cayadetto is of Navajo and Italian descent. At the time of her disappearance she wore glasses. She was known to wear a silver chain with a small turquoise cross pendant. Antoinette Cayadetto was last seen at her family's residence in Gallup, new Mexico on April 6, 1986. She was last seen wearing a pink nightgown. If you have any information concerning this person, please contact your local FBI office or nearest American embassy or consulate Field office is Albuquerque. Okay, so I'll have a little bit more information about her later.
Speaker 1:Okay, sounds good. Yeah, she'd be what 50?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, or almost 50, 49.
Speaker 2:Yep, Okay. So yeah, she'd be a grown-ass woman now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she would, but it's crazy to see she's. We're done Not crazy I'm trying not to use that word, but it's intense, that's a better word To see this missing poster of her and she's just a sweet little kid. Oh, it's hard to imagine. I mean, hopefully she is out there as an adult woman somewhere. But you know, like when you look at your own kids or I look at my kids, it's hard to imagine what they'll be like as adults. Yeah, yeah, I imagine, even though this woman is older than me.
Speaker 1:Still, I mean, when you're looking at a picture and she's quite young, okay, so I am doing Shante and Kenny Kimes. Now some people pronounce it Shante, other people pronounce it Sante. It's S-A-N-T-E, okay, but I don't know.
Speaker 2:Do you know how she pronounced it?
Speaker 1:No, so I mainly got my information from Diabolical Women, episode 1, shantae Kimes, but there are lots of different episodes from various series, like I think even Dateline did one. I know they did an interview on 60 Minutes. I intended to watch all of them but life got in the way. Right, yeah, it's a lot of watching. It is a lot of watching. I had intended to do it all on Friday but my hair appointment took like three hours out of my day, right.
Speaker 2:I was like never, never mind.
Speaker 1:Are you happy with your hair? I am. It's quite light. Yeah, it's cute. That's a lot lighter than it was, so we're thinking about it. My, uh, my hairstylist moved salons right and so they have different, um kinds of like brands and things, brands and things, yeah. So she's not entirely sure what we had used last time, based on the new brand. So, yeah, it's a bit lighter, but that's okay, makes sense. Yeah, it's all right. I don't know, I go much lighter.
Speaker 1:I might be gray or white you can go like silvery white yeah, I don't think I want to do that, though I want to.
Speaker 2:I want to coast into my gray hair our mutual friend always has been a big fan of silvery white hair and she's always said that, that she can't wait to have silvery white hair. So that's what made me think of that. This is her fondness for silvery white hair.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you may not get it, though you might just get the angry gray.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but you can always dye it silvery white. That's true. I think mine will probably go angry gray or whatever the hell.
Speaker 1:I call it angry. Gray Reminds me of barbed wire, I guess yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, thanks for that flattering image.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm going to have it too.
Speaker 2:No, I'll look at my hair in the future and be like just like barbed wire.
Speaker 1:You may be lucky and it'll go white.
Speaker 2:I've had a few strands and those strands appear whitish, but that isn't necessarily reflective of the whole thing.
Speaker 1:No, because you can be gray-white. Yeah, yeah, okay anyway. So we're talking about the crimes of Shanti and Kenny Kimes. So on July 4th 1998, detective Tom Hovigim received a missing persons report. 82-year-old socialite and multimillionaire, irene Silverman, had vanished from her Upper East Side mansion. Now, irene was not someone who would wander away. She was always at home and no one had heard from her Upper East Side mansion. Now, irene was not someone who would wander away. She was always at home and no one had heard from her.
Speaker 1:The police canvassed the neighborhood, they started looking for video and interviewing the people that knew her, and they also gave her picture and information to the news, hoping for public assistance. And within hours they get the names of a couple of suspects. They are identified as a widow and son of a wealthy developer from California, 63-year-old Shante Kimes and 23-year-old Kenny Kimes. Now Shante is often described as a glamorous grifter who's been evading law enforcement or had been evading law enforcement for over 30 years. Her rap sheet had everything from petty theft to murder. Her eldest son, kent, who's interviewed for this episode, claims that she would shoplift food to feed him and force him to be her accomplice. And it wasn't because they couldn't afford food. In fact, I think the husband she was with at the time was quite wealthy. She just liked stealing and breaking the law. Their relationship became strained.
Speaker 2:It's an interesting choice to steal food. Usually, when you hear about people who are like shoplifting addicts or whatever it's like trinkets or things like that, I'm sure she stole other things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he was. I think he was just giving an example of like she had to steal food and most people would be like, well, you may have, you may you know poverty or but it's not true.
Speaker 2:They were millionaires, yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, that's just gross. It is gross, and she made him commit those crimes with her. Yeah, so Sante's childhood is impossible to verify, according to her own son. He claims that some sources say her mother was a sex worker, while others say she was in his word was reputable and she just simply couldn't control her. Either way, I guess she was put up for adoption at age 12. She met her first husband in high school, or I think she was adopted at age 12. I'm not sure.
Speaker 2:When she was put up for adoption, so she was rich, but she had a background of impoverishment, though we don't know If you said her mom was like a sex worker and stuff.
Speaker 1:But that's a. They don't know that. So some sources say yes and some sources say she wasn't.
Speaker 2:Oh okay, because I'm just throwing it out there that sometimes you could have like a poverty trauma and that could maybe cause that sort of thing. Man, if she's just a psychopath, you'll see when we get going.
Speaker 1:Sure, I'm not justifying her violent no, I know, I'm just saying I mean she, she stole other things. It wasn't. Yeah, she'd steal anything she could get her hands on. So she met her first husband in high school and they married five years later, after graduation. They had a nice life, but Shante would rack up bills, in part because of her shoplifting. She would also burn down houses to collect insurance.
Speaker 1:She had multiple affairs, including one with her husband's business partner. They divorced in 1967, and she began immediately looking for a new millionaire. She set her eyes on Kenneth Kimes, who she saw in a magazine and she was like him. I'm going to get him. He was worth about $22 million, which was quite a lot in 1970. They had one son, kenny Kimes, in 75. Kent, who was 13 years older than Kenny, worried about him because his mother was so controlling and manipulative controlling and manipulative he even tried to quote pull him out of her grasp. I don't know what that means. I don't know if, like once he got old enough, he tried to get custody or if he just tried to warn him about the truth of their mother. I don't know what that?
Speaker 1:means, but either way. But kenny remained loyal to shantae and the brothers became estranged and, according to Kent, even enemies. Shante, her husband, and Kenny moved to Mexico in 1982. Shante didn't want Kenny to go to school because she wanted complete control, so she hired a tutor for him tutor for him. The tutor, named Teresa, was interviewed on this episode and she claimed that Shantae molded Kenny to be just like her, for example to talk just like her. One time she also got mad at Teresa for trying to teach Kenny not to lie. She allegedly said there is a time to lie and a time not to lie and she would be the one to teach him. That said there is a time to lie and a time not to lie and she would be the one to teach him that.
Speaker 1:She also bullied a pregnant housekeeper who's from El Salvador. I think her name was Gloria. Well, they lived in Mexico. The housekeeper was never paid and was forced to work, basically from the time she woke up until the time she went to bed at night. So the housekeeper was a slave. Yes, we're getting there.
Speaker 1:One night, sante took Gloria, the housekeeper, and Teresa to dinner at a local restaurant. According to Teresa, they ordered and then Shante told Gloria, let's go. Shante and Gloria left the restaurant and Shante returned 15 minutes later without Gloria. Teresa said that when they got back to the house all of Gloria's things were still in the home, but she was not there and she has never been found. Later, shante stole Teresa's purse, which had basically her whole life in it. I mean, it was her passport, her money, all of that stuff. So Teresa was then at Shante's mercy, like she couldn't just go and get a new ID. She couldn't, just she couldn't prove who she was. So Shante told Teresa that she had to smuggle women into the country for her so that she could have maids without having to pay them.
Speaker 1:Shante had two girls I'm not sure if they were girls or if they were just young women from Guatemala for Teresa to smuggle across. Now Teresa said she didn't want to do it, but she felt that she didn't really have a choice and she had to get to the US side and then she could talk to somebody and get it figured out. But she just needed to get back home. Shante dropped the girls and Teresa off near the border and left, and the girls walked along the beach until they came to an inlet that they then had to cross to get to the United States. A lifeguard sees them and takes them to safety because I guess the tide was really bad and they could have been swept out, and so he takes them to the US side and, for whatever reason, they are not reported to border control.
Speaker 1:All three were picked up by the Kimeses and taken to Las Vegas where they were essentially held like prisoners. After two months Kenneth Kimes took pity on Teresa and bought her a ticket to visit her family. When she finally got to her family she went to the FBI and she told them about Shante, about keeping the girls and all of that stuff, and she said she didn't really have any proof. But in August of 1985, shante and her husband are arrested and charged with involuntary servitude for keeping maids as slaves in their home. Kenneth took a plea deal so he didn't have to do time, but Shante decided to stay on trial. Her trial was held in 1986, and she was ultimately convicted and sentenced to five years. She only served three. By all accounts. Shante became even more dangerous once she was released.
Speaker 1:In 1994, kenneth Kynes died suddenly from aortic aneurysm. He left Shante some money, but it wasn't enough for her and she believed that he had died leaving millions in offshore accounts, and she was worried that there were other heirs from his previous marriage. So she wanted to get the money before any possible heirs could. So she concocted a scheme to do that. So she and Kenny who is at this point 21, tried to use forged documents to access those accounts. But a man named Saeed Balil Ahmed accounts. But a man named Saeed Balil Ahmed, a Bahamian banker, asked too many questions, and so Shantae invited him over for dinner. She gave him a spiked cocktail. Once he passed out, she and Kenny took him to the bathtub, where Kenny attempted to drown him, but he started to wake up. Where Kenny attempted to drown him, but he started to wake up. So Kenny called Shantae in to help him hold him down while he drowned him. The body was subsequently disposed of in the ocean the next day and has never been found.
Speaker 2:So she probably disposed of the maze slave in the ocean too.
Speaker 1:It's possible, yeah, although I don't know how she could have gotten to the ocean in just 15 minutes. But I don't know how she could have gotten to the ocean in just 15 minutes, I don't know.
Speaker 2:Maybe she stowed the body somewhere and then to the leader. Yeah, possible, because 15 minutes is not a big window for anything. No, unless she stowed her like a dumpster or whatever, because there's this episode of the King of the Hill where there's like a murder or whatever in the, or it seems like a murder, I think it ends up being an accidental death, but the body is found in like a dumpster behind a restaurant. So that made me think of that as well. Like that would be somewhere quick to stow a body.
Speaker 1:Yep, okay. So Shante and Kenny never found the money and they wind up fleeing to Los Angeles and search for money somehow. So their new target is their longtime acquaintance, david Kasdan, who was an LA businessman and he had done some real estate transaction with the Kimeses before. So in January 1998, shante began to forge David's name on documents. She took out a $200,000 mortgage on the Las Vegas house in David's name. So somehow she managed to keep the judgments during her trial in the 80s by signing it over to David. So I guess that means she's able to keep the property during her trial in the 80s by signing it over to david. So I guess that means she's able to keep the property by putting it in david's. Yeah, so david found out about the mortgage when he received a phone call from a collections agency about not paying the mortgage payment.
Speaker 1:So when shanti and kenny realized that david was not only on to them but also wasn't going to help them, they knew they would have to kill him. And in February 1998, shante ordered Kenny to kill him. So Kenny, with an accomplice, drove to David's house. The accomplice stayed outside and he heard a pop what he described as a gunshot, and he heard a pop what he described as a gunshot. Kenny then waved him in and he went inside the house and he saw that David had been shot and was lying on the kitchen floor. They took David and headed down to the airport area. They put him in the trunk and then headed down to the airport area where they parked the car, changed clothes and saw a movie and then discarded the body and after he was done, kenny bought shantae some flowers to celebrate. Wow.
Speaker 1:So there's always been questions about their like the true nature of their relationship, like was it just mother and son or was there like an incestuous? Yeah, whatever? Yeah, because they definitely did things that made it seem more like a romantic relationship than father and son. The next day, the lapd got a call about a body in a dumpster, just like you thought by lax. They find out that it's david, through fingerprints. His daughter, when they tell her about it, tells them that he was very fearful of shantae and kenny kimes and that they had been harassing him about something he was seemingly involved in.
Speaker 1:So within days, the trail led police to a room in a Bel Air mansion where Shante and Kenny had been hiding out. They had obviously taken off in a hurry, leaving a bunch of possessions behind. The one clue that the detectives have to track the Kimeses is the luxury car they had been driving. I think it was a lincoln town car. Yeah, they show pictures of it and they kept calling it a luxury car and I guess it was a luxury car, but it does. By today's standards it does not look like a luxury car, it looks like a dad car yeah.
Speaker 2:okay, so the no. But there's definitely a time when those kind of cars were less ostentatious but like I don't know if they were supposed to be really smooth riding and the interiors were blah, blah, blah. Yeah, those were some kind of class of luxury car. Reminds me of Hannibal, although these people are definitely not Hannibal.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:I mean nobody's Hannibal, because Hannibal is a fictional character and not a real serial killer. No that like he has to maintain his like bougie lifestyle.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And drive a fancy car and like order fancy wines and shit like that, and so that's how the FBI is able to track him down after he escapes. If you feel spoiled from Hannibal, it's been out for a really long time, so yeah, okay, so they have the luxury car.
Speaker 1:So the police found that the car had been fraudulently purchased in cedar city, utah, and that allowed the lapd to contact the police in utah and get a local warrant that would allow them to take them into custody for their, their, for that multi-state warrant. I'm sorry if you can hear my like cough drop in my mouth. It's that or coughing so, but the kimes were already heading east across the country and in june 1998 they arrived in new york city to pull off their biggest scam yet. So they had researched wealthy widows with no relatives and in their research they found 82-year-old Irene Silverman from the beginning, oh no who owned a Manhattan mansion, not poor 82-year-old Irenene silverman.
Speaker 2:She sounds like a sweetheart, I know, I don't know, like ladies named irene. For some reason they sound like like a kind of sweet old lady that will feed you like hard candy from like a crystal bowl yeah, she seemed like.
Speaker 1:She sounded like a cool lady. So she owned a Manhattan mansion and that mansion was divided up into 10 individual apartments and suites and Irene would rent them out, so sometimes there would be up to 10 tenants in her house. So Kenny rented an apartment I guess it's more like just like a one room, I think that's what it sounded like. So he rented an apartment in the mansion using a fake reference and the alias Manny Gurin. Shanti moved in with him one week later and they were sharing a bed urine. Shanti moved in with him one week later and they were sharing a bed.
Speaker 1:So that is another reason people question their uh relationship. The plan was to swindle irene out of the mansion, so she forged papers to transfer the title into her name. Uh shante did that. The Kimeses also called a notary over to have the deed signed over. The second part of the plan was to kill Irene, evict the other tenants as well as the staff. I believe there was a staff of six. So Shante hired a man that worked for them before but unbeknownst to them. He had turned informant for the LAPD. Once the police knew where they were going to be at a specific time and a specific place, they were able to contact the NYPD and the New York FBI and request they assist in arresting Shanta and Kenny.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we gotta protect the sweet Irene at all costs.
Speaker 1:So the LAPD and the FBI set up a sting with the informant over the stolen car warrant. Then, on July 4th, the day of Irene's annual Independence Day party, irene spoke to her building manager and friend, jeff Feig, about the young male tenant, manny Gurin, and his older female companion is what they called her. According to Jeff, they talked about how Manny and the older woman were not wanted there and they were very concerned about them. They didn't say concerned about what specifically, just that they were concerned and they decided that they were going to serve them with an eviction notice the Monday after July 4th, so on the 6th, I think would be the day. On July 5th, between 1 and 3 pm, manny carries out the plan. He murdered Irene by strangling her, oh no. He then rolled her up in a shower curtain, put her in a duffel bag, put her in the trunk of his car and then drove her out to New Jersey and dumped her. A few hours later the housekeeper noticed that Irene was missing and so she called Jeff. The police learn about Manny and how the staff and her friends don't trust them, so they go to his apartment to talk to him. But he's not there and neither is the woman who stays with him. So, shanti. All the police find are a shower curtain with a missing liner, and the curtain and the rings were still in the packaging they found gray duct tape and a plastic I'm sorry and plastic garbage bags. So, needless to say, the NYPD began their search for Manny. So while the NYPD were looking for Manny, the LAPD and FBI were setting their sting for Kenny and Shante. Obviously, they don't know at this point that they're actually looking for the same people, that they're actually looking for the same people. Yeah, at 5 pm Shante shows up, or showed up to meet the informant, and she was taken into custody. And then the NYPD observed Kenny conducting counter-surveillance and they take him into custody as well. They are told that they are being taken into custody on the Utah warrant for grand larceny. Within 24 hours the Kimeses were officially prime suspects in Irene's disappearance.
Speaker 1:Now for the Irene Silverman case. Shante and Kenny are charged with multiple counts, including second-degree murder, because her body has never been found. Yeah, the trial began in what horrible people did they think that they were going to get her money? They thought they were going to get her mansion. So the trial began in february 2000 and it lasted for three months, both shantae and kenny received life sentences with no chance of parole. Then in 2002, they are indicted in LA for the murder of David Kasdan.
Speaker 1:They have more evidence in that case than the Irene Silverman case. So, for example, most importantly they have the body. So to avoid execution, the Kimes' first need to admit guilt, so Kent again first need to admit guilt. So Kent again that's Kenny's older brother and Chante's oldest son paid Kenny a visit in the prison to try to convince him to confess and ultimately Kenny agreed to do so. In June 2004, kenny pled guilty to all the murders in a deal to save himself and his mother from the death penalty. Today, kenny is serving his life sentence without parole in California. Shantae died of natural causes in a New York prison in 2014. I believe she was 79. So that's my very, very short case.
Speaker 2:She wasn't very imaginative at naming, was she Kent?
Speaker 1:and Kenneth, kent and Kenny. No Well, kenny was named after Kenneth, the husband.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, if she had a third one, then he would be named like Kenward or something Possibly.
Speaker 1:She certainly was a diabolic woman. Yeah, I mean, according to her son, she could convince anybody to do anything. Yeah, you know, she kind of looked a little bit like Elizabeth Taylor, did she? Yeah, at least when she was young.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because I wasn't really thinking about what she looked like, but I was like what a bitch, yeah, she is. Well, I just mean.
Speaker 1:I think the implication is that she used her beauty in her. Her oldest son said she must have been really good at sex because that's the only way he could think of. She got so many men to do what she said, yeah, yeah, which might be true. She may not have actually slept with them, but she could have, you know, implied, implied it.
Speaker 2:Flirted yeah, et cetera.
Speaker 1:Yes, Is this them? No, that's the TV movie version. Oh no, that guy is from Twin Peaks here I'll show you a picture.
Speaker 2:I don't know what actors look like.
Speaker 1:So that's kind of more along the lines of how she looked in her Elizabeth Taylor era. Okay, I don't see any of her as a very young woman, but they did show it on the show and she was quite pretty. Yeah, most of these are from the the movies. So I mean, yeah, there's not really much to say.
Speaker 2:They're terrible people indeed, although, yeah, I mean obviously like he's a grown man, but there's something to be said for grooming and manipulation from oh yeah when you're a kid. So oh yeah, that's very fucked up it is very fucked up. He was definitely groomed lucky for the older son to have escaped that yeah, he had a temperament for, you know, not falling in line. Yeah, same yeah.
Speaker 1:Yep, yep, yep.
Speaker 2:Okay, Are we ready to hear more about Antoinette Christine Cayadetto? Sure, Okay, it says her mother woke up to find she was not in the house. We went looking for her around the house nothing, Sure, the surrounding foothills Penny's the mother but found no trace of the little girl. Authorities were almost certain she had been kidnapped. The days stretched into weeks and then months. Police could offer little to bolster Penny's hopes of ever finding her daughter alive. After a year had passed, all seemed lost. A dramatic call for help came into the Gallup police station. Oh shit, the voice claimed to be Anthonyoinette Cayodetto and the dispatcher asked where she was. But before the girl could answer, the call was ended by an unidentified man. Detectives played a recording of the call for Penny Cayodetto. I listened to the tape over and over and just by the way she says her last name and the way she screams and chills all over my body, a mother knows, and I knew that it was her. The phone call renewed hope for Antoinette's safe return.
Speaker 2:However, four torturous years passed without any further clues. The FBI released two computer-enhanced photographs showing what Anthonette might look like at the age of 14. Four months later, according to agent Kevin Miles, the FBI, a possible city of Anthonette was reported in Carson City, Nevada. A waitress in a restaurant in Carson City told the Carson City police about a strange incident she had witnessed that particular day. She waited on a table at which sat a male and a female, rather unkempt, and a small girl about the age of 14 or 15. The girl would deliberately drop a utensil on the floor. The waitress put the utensil back on the table and the little girl grabbed her hand, and the waitress thought nothing of it and went about her business. The threesome left the restaurant and the waitress went back to the table and began to bust the table. She lifted the plate belonging to the girl. Beneath was a napkin that said please help me call the police. By the time she realized what had happened, the couple and the girl were gone.
Speaker 2:Shortly after the Carson City sighting, Penny turned to her own Native American heritage in the search for Anthonette. She and her other daughter visited a respected Nadeau Navajo medicine woman skilled in performing traditional tribal ceremonies. The medicine woman performed the crystal ritual, which is said to make contact with the spirit of a missing person. According to the medicine woman, Anthonette was still alive and may have a child. She was being held against her will by threats of violence somewhere in the southwest Penny, was amazed that the information provided by the medicine woman was consistent with the elements of the detective's investigation. Going to the medicine woman gave me a lot of strength and it helps me to just know that she is alive. No matter who she's with, they've got to have some compassion, not to hurt another. Being as small as she is, Athena Cayadento was nine years old when she disappeared. Today she would be in her 30s, Well, in her late 40s now. Yeah, she has brown hair and brown eyes. Her birthday is December 25th. Well, that was more harrowing than I expected it to be.
Speaker 2:Jesus. Yeah, sounds like there's a very real possibility that she is alive. Yeah, could be, so that's awful it is. Is alive? Yeah, could be, so that's awful it is. So if you're out there, anthony, I hope that you are safe and can, yeah, are safe wherever you are, yeah, and have autonomy. Yeah, okay, and yeah, that's my case.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, and yeah, that's my case. Alright, so I guess now it's time for what you've been reading, watching.
Speaker 2:Yes, so what did we talk about last time? I always forget, like, where did we leave off last time? Let me check all my Goodreads. Did I talk about Tess of the Road last time? Let me check all my good reads. Did I talk about test of the road last time? Test of the? What? Test of the road? That fantasy book I read, I don't know. So I read a fantasy book called test of the road. So that was pretty.
Speaker 2:Test of the road, test of the Road, tess of the Road yeah, it was pretty good. It was darker than I expected and it was not a romantic scene. So, yeah, it was pretty good. It was a bit of a growing up journey kind of thing. Yeah, this person coming of age that's what I'm thinking of. Coming of age story yeah, this person is finding themselves, finding their footing and also finding forgiveness for themselves for taking on the blame right of that in their society and in many societies that women take on for just existing and being part of the world. So, yeah, it was good. It does have themes of depression, suicidal ideation, sexual assault and emotional abuse and things like that. So that's something to, yeah, that's something to. And generational trauma yeah, trauma, yeah. So but yeah, I thought it was pretty good. And uh, I read those across the river by christopher bullman about a couple who move into like a southern community because he's he wants to write a book about his great-granddaddy plantation owner blah blah, eye roll or whatever, but also because him and his lady are escaping their reputations because he's stole or not stole but him and his current partner are the product of infidelity because she was married to another faculty member at the university that he had been a professor at, and they got together, and so it ruined his reputation, it ruined his career and
Speaker 2:so they're escaping from that and he's also escaping from PTSD and they're moved to this place and things are not quite right, right? So I don't want to give too many spoilers. I liked the beginning, I liked the end. I didn't like.
Speaker 2:I felt like there were moments where, like, of course, they're showing like this, like deep southern community with ties to whatever slave ownership and stuff in the past and, of course, deep racial tensions and things like that. But I thought at times, like you know how sometimes things are unnecessarily, you know, and I felt like there were times when they appropriately showed that racial disparity and times when the author was just like it's fun to say the N-word, and I was like you already got your point across and you didn't need to do it like 10 more times, right and so that, and you didn't need to do it like 10 more times, right and so that part I didn't love and I I don't know. There's some other things I would like to say about it, but I can't really do so without giving away spoilers for the book. So, but, um, for the genre that it was in, I don't know, it didn't excite me about that genre as much as I had hoped, but there were definitely moments that there were definitely some good moments.
Speaker 2:Is it like horror? Yeah, it's horror, it's horror. It's like a suspenseful horror, I would say, and like kind of like a creeping dread this community is not quite right kind of horror. Okay, okay and yeah, but yeah, it's all right. So yeah, maybe check it out if you like that sort of thing. I definitely liked his vampire book a lot better though.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm. So, which one?
Speaker 2:was the vampire book. Let me check out the name of it. Just a second the Lesser Dead. Yeah, that one was pretty fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, cool, I'm still reading the nonfiction from the last time we talked the everything must go. Yeah, um, it's really good. It's just I got sidetracked by a new book called um uh, dungeon crawler carl it's, it's actually really good. I saw I I watch BookTube sometimes and one of my favorite BookTubers, gavin, reads it all. He was listening to it on Audible and he liked it so much went and bought the hard copy. So I guess my understanding, because I went and got it from the barnes and noble in el paso and the I guess he's the manager of the store or something he ran into me and he like couldn't stop talking about it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, but I guess it was like two words at barnes and no, no no, no, a different person.
Speaker 1:Oh okay, gaven's in england or something, okay I was confused or gavin there is in england people, I say gavin, but it's gavin. Uh, the manager saw me carrying that along with some other books and he talked about it a lot. He liked it so much he's buying the whole series as it comes out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I guess it was self-published, nice, and now it's gotten such traction that they're it's getting a I don't want to say proper publishing, but you know, like a, yeah, some reputable, not reputable, but a big publishing house you know, sometimes that's the fucking way right, yeah so, um, the book is about, uh, this guy who's just broken up with his girlfriend but she's out of town and so he's, um, cat sitting and her name is she has a really long name, but it's shortened to princess donut and she's like an award-winning cat, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And she gets stuck outside and it's a very cold night and he runs out to get her. He's dressed in his boxers and a jacket and like these pink crocs that don't fit him I think it was the girlfriends, or whatever, yeah, and all of a sudden all of the buildings collapse and pretty much anybody or any living creature that was inside something with a roof, even a car, die, oh no, and a computer voice comes on and it says you can either stay out here and try to survive or you can go into the tunnels and try to survive there, and it's this big like RPG game, basically to the death. Like, you have levels, you have to go up you level, you know your strength, or blah, blah, blah. You eventually have to pick your class and your whatever you want to be. But it's, it's a, it's a lot of fun.
Speaker 1:The cat starts to talk and the guy becomes her manservant as far as she's concerned and you know that every floor has a boss and whatever the goal is to get all the way down to the last level.
Speaker 2:So is the cat the real hero.
Speaker 1:I don't know yet. I'm only 100 pages in and it's like a 500-page book and there's eight of them apparently. Yeah, so the goal is to get down to the very last floor, which I think is the 18th, and if you can get down there then you can be the head of your world nobody's ever gotten down there.
Speaker 1:They've never. I think the the farthest anyone got was like the 12th floor and they were killed immediately, yeah, so, um, they're just trying to survive. You can, once you get to the higher levels, they have options of you just kind of exiting, but you basically they haven't set it out right but it's implied that you kind of become like a slave to the overlords of this world or this game or whatever, and um, they reincarnate you every time they take over a planet.
Speaker 1:But it's also also. It's not just an RPG game, it's also on television, it's a reality TV game, and so you also, you can't just survive, you have to get views and likes and subscribers, yeah, and you can't stay on a level. It collapses after a certain amount of time. Anyway, it's a lot of fun. It sounds like fun.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's fun and it's amusing, so I've been distracted with that you should send me the name, because that sounds like something I would want to read too.
Speaker 1:Okay, and I've also been continuing with the Thursday Murder Club. I just started the third one on audio. I really enjoyed the first two on audio but they changed narrators for the third one at. The fourth one is another completely new, and I haven't listened to her. But I don't like the third one. No offense to the lady, I'm sure she's fine, but now all the characters sound different. Yeah, you know that's annoying.
Speaker 2:Yeah I don't like that. But like, on the flip side, I also don't like it when, like, all of the books by the same author are like narrated by the same audiobook narrator, because then sometimes, like with the Mona Awad books, it makes it hard for me to separate, like the characters in the different books, like it makes it almost like it's like all one story.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Well, these are series and it's all the same characters. Yeah, no, I understand that um, in that case then, yes, I do want the same voices yeah, um, and also I mean maybe it wouldn't be such a big deal if I wasn't reading them so close together, like I literally started. The third one this minute.
Speaker 1:The second one ended and so it was kind of jarring, you know, yeah. And so now I'm like wait, what character are we talking about? Because that's not how they sounded. The the other one, I'm sure she's a fight narrator, I think it's more of a my fault for listening too close together. I think they came out probably years apart, right?
Speaker 2:Originally. Yeah, maybe that's. Maybe the other narrators were not available.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I guess that's all I've been reading, watching. What have I done? Nothing, really, just BookTube. I've been catching up on all the BookTube I missed, yeah. And so now I've got a bunch of books I want to read that I probably will never read.
Speaker 2:I'm so curious about like booktube, but like I don't even know, like know like where to start. Like I, I have seen some videos, recommendations that just like pop up, but like I don't want a billion like romantic recommendations.
Speaker 1:Like, like, like. What would you like? Because I don't even get any romance right, like booktubers I mean, you know what I like.
Speaker 2:I like horror, I like fantasy, but not romanticy. I like uh, you know, like sci-fi, I like some mystery, like you know, some like mixed genre kind of things.
Speaker 1:Um, I'll, I'll send you a few that I have. They kind of do a mix of everything and from there you can kind of I don't find people.
Speaker 2:I was reading a thread the other day about like whatever romantician and like I think I really pinpointed whatever this. The thing that bothered me about like romanticism is that it's trying so hard to like fill all the like tropes or whatever that, like romance readers expect rather than and the, the, the fantasy is like just the setting, yeah, um, yeah, whereas yeah, so I don't mind like romance, like I'm not shitting on romance although it's just not the fantasy you want to read yeah, exactly, I'd rather my fantasy be fantasy, with maybe a little side romance.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so anything else. I also read the New Girl by Jesse Q Sutanto and the Collector by Laura Kat Young. Okay, so those were the other books that I read yeah what are their genres? Young adult, like kind of thriller, and dystopian future, dystopian kind of world. The collector I feel like young adult, the new girl one, it's okay, like the protagonist aggravated me in some of her like decision making, so um yeah, oh, is that the one you were talking about, where, like she like takes somebody out into?
Speaker 1:the woods or something and murders them and there's like drugs involved, yep. Yeah, she seemed like a I don't know.
Speaker 2:I think that this is one that maybe, like you know how some young adult books are, like they're fine for adults to read. This one is more like it's probably more better for more more better.
Speaker 2:Well, I said I certainly I sound like a teenager, so, um, but yeah, it's probably more suited for actual teenagers yeah, so because of their poor decision making skills there were just a lot of parts where I was just like don't do that, you idiot Right, and like you know, like have some common sense, but like, of course, in reality, most teens don't have a lot of common sense probably those decisions wouldn't seem so irrational to an actual teen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, the collector is like a slow burn, dystopian future type of novel. Yeah, it's kind of a world sort of Brave New World-esque, sort of 1984. People can't be depressed, or they. They get their memories wiped, yeah, but first they, uh, they have to give a collection of like one memory or whatever, to like some for some database although what is actually done with all the memories in the database is unknown, and it's the job of this person to collect these memories. So this person has to show up and basically tell these people that their memory is about to be wiped and even though I guess whatever they're supposed to have received correspondence in the mail.
Speaker 2:But of course these people are depressed or grieving. Grief is also considered a no-no.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And so they're upset, and so he has to convince them to give a memory to the collection and that he records it. And so, of course, in collecting all of these memories and seeing all these people in these harrowing moments, he of course becomes depressed himself and so he gets in trouble himself. So, yeah, that's a bit of a synopsis of what happens in that book, and I'm currently reading um the new CJ lead book, which is called American.
Speaker 1:Rapture. I keep calling it American.
Speaker 2:Scripture. I want to call it, I keep wanting to call it American Psycho, different book. I know, I know it's not American Psycho, but I'm like American, I'm like what comes next.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I keep. I. That's why I keep saying American Scripture. I know it's not American Scripture, but for some reason that's what I keep thinking. It is American Rapture.
Speaker 2:I'm not very far into it yet, but so far it's very captivating. I'm not very far into it yet, but so far it's very captivating. Different from Mayfly, but captivating in its own way and very much same voice, yeah, so that's good, yeah, yeah, it's going to be hard for her to get away from Mayfly.
Speaker 1:To top it, yeah her to get away from mayfly to to top it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because it's such a beloved book by certain people.
Speaker 1:Well, a lot of I mean I think pretty much everybody that read it liked it. I don't think it got that many yeah, uh I don't know about like reviews reviews, but like people who review it. I don't think she got many like negative ones. That reminds me you should go on instagram because I sent you things okay, and one of them is a bunch of valentine cards from that are mayfly inspired that. I don't know if cj lead made them or somebody else did, but it's I think it's from's from her account.
Speaker 2:Okay, nice, I will check that out.
Speaker 1:Some of some of them aren't great, but there are a few that are like remind you of the book You're like wonderful. Okay. I'll check it out I was like oh yeah, I forgot that. What happened? Yeah, yeah, uh, yeah, I guess maybe that's it. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, okay, nothing exciting too much this time. I think it's gonna be a short one, which is okay, and oh, uh, one more time. What's the book next episode?
Speaker 2:it is called the dinosaur thief. I want to say I'm like going off my memory, which is never reliable the Dinosaur Artist. See, I didn't even get the title right. It's called the Dinosaur Artist by Paige Williams.
Speaker 1:The Dinosaur Artist by Paige Williams. Okay, and that is going to be our next episode, which I believe is episode 34. Or was that supposed to be this episode? I don't know. We'll figure it out. It's next episode. We didn't read it, so it's definitely not going to be this episode. Okay, so Dinosaur Hunter, artist Artist Dinosaur Artist by Paige Williams, and information on that is going to be in the show box.
Speaker 2:It will be the correct information.
Speaker 1:It will be the correct information and you can check out our socials as well. We have personal Instagrams and podcast Instagrams and a Facebook and an email, which Rachel should be checking periodically.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Questions would be nice, or just comments. Nice comments, I mean, you could give us critiques, but be nice about it. Yes, gentle critiques.
Speaker 2:What Gentle critiques. Give us critiques, but be nice about it.
Speaker 1:Yes, gentle critiques.
Speaker 2:What.
Speaker 1:Gentle critiques. Gentle critiques yes, yeah, I think that's it so like subscribe, download, review and we will see you next time. Bye.
